Life as an Island Bat Group

S1E10 The British Isles have a large number of islands around its coasts and some of these have bat groups. In this episode Steve discusses the challenges of being an isolated voluntary group with Carol Williams who is  the secretary of the Isles of Scilly Bat Group and with Ani Binet who until recently was a resident on Jersey in the Channel Islands and an active member of the Jersey Bat Group.

There is also some news hot off the press from the Isle of Man Bat Group. You can read more about the exciting news at our press release here: https://www.bats.org.uk/news/2020/02/lesser-horseshoe-bat-found-in-the-isle-of-man

To discover more of the bat groups around the UK, head to the bat group pages on the Bat Conservation Trust website: https://www.bats.org.uk/support-bats/bat-groups. Their Facebook page is here: https://www.facebook.com/ManxBatGroup/

Join the conversation on social media using #BatChat:
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For more bat news, head to our website https://www.bats.org.uk/

Producer: Steve Roe @SteveRoeBatMan
Cover Art: Rachel Hudson http://rachelhudsonillustration.com/info

Transcript

Steve Roe: 0:03

Welcome to BatChat the podcast from the Bat Conservation Trust. This week, we're finding out what life is like as an island back group. Later on, we've got some news hot off the press from the Isle of Man. But first back in September at the National Bat Conference, I joined Ani Binet and Carol Williams to discuss the challenges of being part of a bat group where the sea is never far away. Ani Binet is a trustee of the Bat Conservation Trust and professional ecological consultant by day and quite often by night as well. And until recently, she was one of the 106,000 residents of the Isle of Jersey, in the Channel Islands. So any for the people listening at home, who, like me have never been to Jersey, you just paint a picture of the islands and what it's like living.

Ani Binet: 0:47

So it's nine miles by five miles. So it's pretty tiny. But the roads are incredibly windy. So it takes an incredibly long time to get anywhere, especially with the 40 mile per hour speed limit. It's kind of sloped in one direction. So the South Coast quite low. And then the North Coast has kind of got lots of cliffs and sea caves and lots of lovely beaches all around the island, really, and then a few little wooded valleys.

Steve Roe: 1:12

So if you were to walk around the perimeter, how long would it take roughly?

Ani Binet: 1:15

There's actually an island walk that happens every year. And it takes about 24 hours to go all the way around.

Steve Roe: 1:22

I had no idea it was that big!

Ani Binet: 1:24

Because they wiggle up and down around the coast. It's about 48 miles, I think.

Steve Roe: 1:28

So how many of the Channel Islands I've got bat groups? Is it just jersey? Or are there others as well.

Ani Binet: 1:33

Alderney and Guernsey have both got them as well. So the three kind of biggest islands have all got their own bat groups,

Steve Roe: 1:39

And how many people are involved across all of those islands?

Ani Binet: 1:42

Um, it varies. So Guernsey's got about 10 people, I think at the moment, but it fluctuates quite a lot. They did have about 30 people at one point. And then it went down again. And Alderney is basically just the Wildlife Trust. And then they have kind of members of the public that go out on their back walks and things.

Steve Roe: 2:03

And you were the founding member of Jersey bat group. So when and why was it set up by yourself?

Ani Binet: 2:10

I wasn't the founding member!

Steve Roe: 2:13

Go on then correct me.

Unknown: 2:15

So no the bat group started decades ago, but it kind of failed and was reset up in about 2006. And I joined not long after that after moving to the island and then became chair in 2008. And I've been kind of really heavily evolved since then, and basically pushed and founded the research side of it. Because before that it was just kind of emergent surveys and reactive surveying rather than kind of searching out new roofs and finding out what species there were and that kind of stuff. So.

Steve Roe: 2:52

So in those years since the audience had the bat group created, what work has been undertaken and what discoveries have been made.

Ani Binet: 2:58

And so there's there's been quite a lot of work, but it was kind of slow for a few years. And then in about 2014 Everything just snowballed massively, and we had all the projects go on at the same time. So we did a big risk register project where I spent the entire summer going kind of putting all of the data together and then going around and trying to verify whether these roots still existed, what species were there, and just doing kind of lots of scoping surveys and emergence surveys. We also started a bat box scheme that year as well to see if we could get any bats to go into the boxes had a few what many. We started a woodland project that was doing kind of acoustic monitoring. I started a hibernation swarming project because nobody had any idea what was happening in the winter. And we just kind of started hammering it at that point. And then in 2016, I got licenced for advanced survey techniques. And we started actually kind of going out and trapping and proactively trying to get a more of a baseline as to what species we had and we discovered lots of new species by doing that.

Steve Roe: 4:05

So what species have been recorded them and so

Unknown: 4:10

this is why I list them all off. So as the kind of resident breeding species we've got common soprano with fuzziness ankles pipistrelles, grey and brown long eared Natterer's Alcathoe and serotine as the actual breeding species. We then also have greater horseshoe lesser horseshoe Geoffroy's um, I've lost count already. Daubetnon's we've had a couple of records of as well whiskered. There's been a couple of records. A few records of Savi's pipistrelle, get it right. I think that's I think that's all of them.

Steve Roe: 4:54

So just a few them. Yeah, just

Ani Binet: 4:56

a few. I think it's 18 In total,

Steve Roe: 4:58

and how many roosts have been found in that time roughly.

Unknown: 5:02

I think when I stopped doing the roost register project, it was over 300. But new roosts are being found all the time by the consultants things in relation to developments and things. So there's pretty much every house and every tree on the island seems to have a battery in it at some point. And you've got quite a few migrant species that you mentioned like cause and Geoffroy's, what do we know about those on the islands so far? So calls we know we have a breeding population. And there are there's one maternity roost that's been known about for about 10 years now. And they go back to the same house every year. There's then a couple of other areas where we've caught juveniles and we there was one particular net that we put up that we ended up with, I think, 21 calls in it and one night, which was adult females and juveniles. So we'd obviously managed to hit a kind of commuting route from the maternity roost, but we've not managed to actually pinpoint exactly where that roosters we know which kind of urban centre it's in, but which building we don't really know at the moment. And Geoffroy's we know very little about, we have exactly three records. What is DNA from a barn that was getting developed in I think 2012 That was discovered. I then caught one in a harp trap in 2017. And then we found one hibernating in an underground tunnel in the winter of kind of 2017 2018 as well. And they're all of our records. And how is the back group been received by the other non bat people on the island, the other residents?

Ani Binet: 6:39

I think, generally, they just think we're a little bit weird. About the place called a few times for lurking in graveyards, you know, all the usual things that workers get accused of. But mostly they're they've been quite receptive. And when we're out kind of tracking and things, it's usually kind of random dog walkers that will come and have a look. And we'll show them that and get people confused about how cute and furry they are, and the fact that they're not ugly and terrifying at all.

Steve Roe: 7:10

And what are the challenges of being an island back group compared to more mainland groups,

Unknown: 7:16

Lack of experience and resources are the main things because you basically have to go off Island to get a lot of the training and a lot of the experience. And so when I was training, I spent a lot of time kind of leaving the island to go and do bad stuff. And then going back to try and go, Look, I could do this now. Can we can we start? Oh, we haven't got the kit. Okay, can we find some money? There's a very kind of limited pool of financial options, despite it being kind of financial centre in the island. So yeah, it's, it's challenging.

Steve Roe: 7:53

And recently, you've left the island island behind and moved to the mainland. What do you miss most about the Isle of Jersey. Um,

Unknown: 8:03

I miss being able to kind of find out new things and miss discovering stuff about the island all the time. So I was resident there for kind of 12 years. And it was only in the kind of latter half of that, that we suddenly started finding all this stuff out about bats. And there's so much still to find out that I kind of miss being the one able to kind of push it forwards and find it out. But it's there's lots of things I don't miss, like how small it was. And presumably the group still active. Do you know what future studies the group's got plans? Yeah, they are selective. There's, there's a new Ireland conservation MSC that starting this year in collaboration with the University of Exeter, and there's some back projects that are getting funded through that. So there's one in particular, that is focusing on urban bats. Because very little is known about the bats in the urban centres in the island. We know that cause pipistrel are there. They're an urban specialist. And we know kind of two of the urban centres that they're in, but we don't know much else about the urban bat. So I know they're doing that. And then carrying on with kind of the the woodland project and finding out what bats are in The Woodlands, as well. And Henry is, has been doing his audio off base project again this year to start the jersey bat survey where basically volunteers will get an audio monitor out then they collect it back in again. And the data gets all kind of put together to see what that's aware in the island when and how it varies through the year.

Steve Roe: 9:41

And if you so choose three words to describe for that conservation movement. What would they be

Ani Binet: 9:48

exhausting. incredibly rewarding. I realised that's more than one word. And fascinating.

Unknown: 9:59

Anybody Thank you very much. So I've just grabbed Carol Williams from Bat Conservation Trust, who is Director of Conservation. And she is also the secretary of the Isles of Scilly bat group. So Carol, presumably, the group is doing lots of stuff over there, can you just paint a picture for the people who've never been to Italy, what it's like to live over there?

Carol Williams: 10:24

Oh, it's absolutely amazing. There are five inhabited islands and a whole array of uninhabited ones. The population over there naturally is relatively small and mostly centred on one of the islands. And the natural history over there is quite stunning. But of course, you have to take into consideration that they are islands and they are isolated. It's a fair old hop over to the mainland, you're talking about 20 miles or so. And so there is something there about that, that we have yet to fully understand. So when you're a bat worker over there, you're not going to get the full range of species. And the species that are there, predominately common pipistrelle, you have to think, Well, I've always been here. Are they finding all that they need on these islands? Or is there more exchange with the mainland? And then we do get other species turn up. Not surprisingly, perhaps noctule? Not surprisingly, perhaps Nathusius' pipistrelle and by the way, that was so exciting. We did the Nathusius' pipistrelle survey over that this summer. And we thought we've only got two nights, how likely are we when the records are so few to catch one? And we did and I can tell you it was huge excitement from all the wonderful members of the bat group, and Cornwall bat group who came over there to facilitate that. But then we do have some mysteries because we also have not a lot of records of them. But we do have brown long-eared bat or a long-eared bat, I guess I should probably say. So it's it's all about you have a small resource over there. Years back, the bats almost died out. Was this when there was a lot more use of pesticides? Probably. Has that been rectified to a degree? Yes. Are there more animals grazing back on the honours that almost dwindled to zero. Now, local produce is massively valued. So you have more cattle over there. So there are a range of things that are mean they're very vulnerable. If something changes, they don't have an easy other option over there. That one thing they do have, and we're really interested in on the islands, and shared with other islands of coastal areas, this strand line, you see the birds feeding there in the day, we know they use it to an extent but just how important is the strand line for bats in these islands in particular, but also in coastal areas. So there's not that many people over there. It's not easy for us to get people to come and help over there because they always have to pay a watch of money to get across on the ferry or to fly over. So I think we achieve amazing things over there. There's long term monitoring of Reuss, and of transits. And we learn bit by bit, and we have had researchers come over there and bolster what we know, with some concentrated work and radio tracking. But somehow there's more Island mysteries, then perhaps on the mainland, lots to find out.

Steve Roe: 13:24

And just to pick up on the point where you said, if something happens to those populations, they're in more trouble than they will be here on the mainland? Presumably, that's because they're an island population. It's hard to repopulate from outside of that population. Are the islands subject to the same laws that we have here on the mainland? Or do they have slightly different laws,

Unknown: 13:43

though they have here on the other city, they're exactly the same laws. Unlike obviously, if you're talking about Jersey or Guernsey, where that will, in fact, vary. So they are the same laws, but it's, it's also, how can I put it is a remote community and things that change. And there are changes in policy and the processes and how it's applied. It's not quite so easy to do the catch up over there. And I would say that, perhaps in line with the mainland, but maybe a bit worse, if you went back when we were first looking at these matches over there. So 25 years ago, the profile for bats, the recognition of the importance of the processes, was not as great. Now, things have moved on a pace. And that would be another factor that would have helped, as the tourism has always been important over there. But as a lot of the older buildings were actually restored to be used for for tourism purposes. Was it at a time when the processes were as clearly in place? Maybe not. That might have been another factor in the losses that we had. We will never know that but now there's a lot of awareness. There's a lot of interest and through the as well as the bat group, you've got the Scilly Wildlife Trust, and you have the council there. And they're all talking and they're all working together. So what we've seen is from the lowest point where it was predicted that they would actually die out over there, that they are slowly but surely picking up. So I think all aspects are now considered more, but it's still always vulnerable. It wouldn't, it always feels like it just wouldn't take a lot to tip the balance, and to see them under threat again, I was gonna say the the islands of world famous for their bird life how, how is the bat group formation been received by the other Islanders? Actually, it's, it's really positive. And the lovely thing is in our back group, as I say, sometimes members, the back will say, Oh, we haven't got as many members as other counties and other back groups. And then I say, Hang on, think about the percentage of your population. And it's absolutely fantastic. We do have people who are members who come there on holiday too, because they're so interested, but from the islanders, we have a good representation. And it includes the fabulous Lee and experienced and long standing bird groups. So there is there is this recognition that the islands are really special, there's a recognition that actually some of the methods of knowing what's happening with birds and with that has a common line in it too. And that's why it's fabulous when we did in this UCS survey to have the bird is there with us. And, and it's really got that level of enthusiasm going and there is the possibility that things could turn up there and in the same way too. So I don't suppose we'll ever have the profile that like the twitches coming over there in mass droves, we're not gonna get that for bet. But there is a realisation, that it's a it's a scattering of islands in the middle of the ocean is all a bit special. It's all a bit lovely. And it does have some some aspects that threaten mainland populations that don't occur there in the same ways, perhaps. But I was remember years ago, there was a programme on this that was looking at the islands and its nature and the, the pressures on it. And it was identifying that actually, it was like looking at the small scale of what affects the mainland, but you could see it more easily. So it's it's sort of that litmus paper, you can just see it, how are things? What can we do? What are the threats? What can we do? And how effective is that? You can you can do it there. But if you get it wrong, then they're gone. And to repopulate would not be as easy as moving in from a neighbouring colony.

Steve Roe: 17:34

How long ago was the bat group setup? How many years ago?

Carol Williams: 17:37

Now? I've got to think about that. Now you caught me out. I think it was probably it was probably about 2008, I'd have to check on that when it came out. There wasn't about group, cornerback group went over there because we had heard reports from Rosemarie Posner about the bats might die out. So we went over there. Finally, we're still there, went back and started to talk to the islanders. And one couple in particular just got the bug and said, right, we're going to set up a bat group. And they are still very actively involved in that. And and that's my can anger. And so it all started back then. But it's it's a struggle. I'm actually Secretary there now, although I don't live on the islands. But I do know them very well, just because it's always difficult to get committee members, when you've got a whole counties worth of people, when you've got a small scattering of people, it's it's difficult to keep that momentum. But the enthusiasm is great. And in fact, the committee is now strong. And we're we're looking to a future where we'll find out more and have more collaborations, more investigations, and be able to keep monitoring those populations and hopefully see them continue on the trajectory they appear to have been on for the last few years, which is actually gaining ground back something close to what we used to have anecdotally were people who'd lived there all their lives would say, oh, all these buildings actually full of it, and they'd come out at night. And you know, that died almost away. And we're just hoping to start heading back towards that.

Steve Roe: 19:14

And so you've said that one of the difficulties have been an island back group is trying to find those people around because of the smaller number of people there have only been a set for Jersey, it was a case of trying to get the skill set up what sort of other challenges are there for life as a Island back group?

Carol Williams: 19:33

That is quite a large part of it. So the difficulty we have particularly there is we want representation from all five of the inhabited islands. Actually, we want to learn about the uninhabited ones too, of course, but that brings its own problems. So Sue, just want to have a back group meeting and uh, normally people say well, I'll finish work and I'll drive over it to me. You have to think what's the tide? Like? Are the boats running at that time? Uh, can I get back I In any way, you know, if it's in the active season, most people one way or another involved in the tourist industry. And so this is an incredibly busy time of year they go quiet. So what what should we do for the back group? Well, it's actually quite quiet for bands now to because you're you're into October November time. So it's actually just being able to get those people together in one place has a constraint and and a time limitation on it. So it's, again, that's not unfamiliar, or mainland back groups. But it just is a bit plus plus when you're talking about tides and boat times. And if you want to do something late, if you do something late anywhere else, you could say, right, and then I'll get my car, you know, I might snooze right? And then I'll drive him but you say there are no boats running? How would you get back to your home? If you've been out? And we had this with the shopping that we did? It was fantastic. All the people on St. Mary's the biggest island could join us. But how about the people who had to go back to Briar or Treska St. Martin's and Agnes, there are no boots running never had to hire a boat specifically to take them back or find somewhere to stay and not get him till the next day. So there are those sort of logistical issues, as well as the fact that that work over on the islands hasn't been carried out by a lot of people for a long time. And so skill sets is always going to be an issue. It's a small population. You can get people trained up, we have people from the Wildlife Trust taking over what Michael Van Gogh used to do to provide assistance. But it's how often is it used? So you have a lot of skills, and you're not going to use them very often it's difficult to sustain that. So it tends to be reliant on some sort of level of input from outside the island. And all the issues about the cost and the time taken to do that.

Steve Roe: 21:51

What about the future of survey work on the island? What's the background got planned for the future?

Carol Williams: 21:57

Oh, there's what we actually did at the last meeting. We got terribly excited because we started to find out more. So we've actually looked at the things that are questions that we still want to answer. So we want to know more about misuses. We want to understand the relationship between the pipistrelles between the islands where we've got largest on Tresco, we've got large ish, not quite as large constant mirrors. How do they interact? How can we have got soprano pipistrelles on one island and not on the others? How on earth? Are they sustaining themselves? There are more questions and answers. The more we learn the more we want to find out brown long haired what's happening there. The we've had a few records, we absolutely know there was confirmed as brown on the board. We did actually track one. So what's actually happening there. So there's so much to learn. But the answers to those. Some of them are just time and we'll get there. Some of them require a bit more specialist input. And we actually have to plan that. But we have we are very likely to have the same fabulous enthusiastic crew get together next summer to become a pickup on the hot trapping that we did this last summer for nuts uses pivot Shetland to start to think how do we address these other questions? So loads to do, I think we're going to grow and grow and find out more. And that will also the benefit the close ties between the community will instal the answers and the protections along the way.

Steve Roe: 23:27

And if you had to choose just three words to describe the bat conservation movement in the UK, what would they be in the UK?

Carol Williams: 23:36

Passionate, strong, isolated

Unknown: 23:42

Carol Williams Thank you very much. And the Manx bat group is very excited to announce that it has recently recorded the presence of lesser horseshoe bats on the island. This species is not one of those previously known to be resident. And so this discovery brings the total number of bass species recorded for the Isle of Man to nine. The identity of this species was confirmed by DNA analysis of bat droppings retrieved from the cellar of a house located in the south of the island. There were no bats present at the time. So it's not currently known how many bats rooster the site, the group will be gearing up for the field work in the coming season and beyond to find out more they need volunteers to join their monitoring activities this summer. So if you would like to be part of this exciting activity and to know more whether it's walking routes at night record bats as part of that search, counting bats as they leave their roosts or perhaps working with bat boxes then they would love to hear from you. You can get in touch with them via Facebook or their website. Links to both are in the show notes below. Thanks for listening to this episode, why not join the conversation online using the hashtag Bat Chat. Next time we're speaking with Jim Mulholland on the subject of back centuries, so consider hitting that subscribe button or for us Spotify listeners out there the Follow button to make sure that the episode arrives automatically when it's released in two weeks' time.